Wednesday, August 29, 2007

The Nature of Humanity



"We are each our own devil, and we make this world our hell." --Oscar Wilde


"We are each of us angels with only one wing, and we can only fly by embracing one another." --Lucretius


Please read the above quotations. Which one more closely fits your personal philosophy and why? Which one might Gabriel Garcia Marquez and/or Nathaniel Hawthorne agree with and why? Do you think the two quotations necessarily oppose each other?

30 comments:

Laurab said...
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Laurab said...

I agree with the second quote. Every person is slightly good, but we are led astray so many times by evil, that it takes extra support to help us be good.
I think the authors would have agree with this quote because each person needs help from another to help us regain our lives back. Goodman Brown needed Faith and the people of the town needed the angel. I think that the quotes do not necessarily oppose each other. They are basically saying the same thing. Each person isn't fully good, and we slip and trip up which makes it harder for us to be good.

CMeghan said...

Hello everyone!

Not such a long post this time, I promise!!!

Well, being an optimist, and a generally happy person, I am inclinced to prefer the second quote. I am also working on being a more spiritual person, so the reference to angels greatly appeals to me. I agree with Julia; it is hard for a person alone to be truly good or refrain from sin. People weren't meant to be alone; we are pack creatures like dogs or wolves and like geese, we all ideally try to have one spouse all our lives. My personal philosophy is that no one should be alone, and it is okay to seek help, encouragement, and love, so this quote by Lucretius is my choice!

I think Gabriel Garcia Marquez and Nathaniel Hawthorne would agree with BOTH quotes; despite being geared towards different aspects of humanity's good and evil, they say essentially the same thing: either good or evil, we control our own circumstance. I believe Marquez would agree more with Lucretius, and his philosphy of help, whereas Hawthorne would agree more with Wilde's perceptions of evil, sin, and a person's individual power in this world.

Well hey, that's all from me!

Loads of love to everyone, see you tomorrow!
~Meghan

juliab said...

I personally agree with the second quote by Lucretius, because I see this quotes message lived out daily in the people around me, whether I know them or not. When you don't have anyone to confide in or have a relationship with, you feel alone in the world and depressed. With the help of friends, a person can come closer to being the person they want to be. This quote also could/does represent the idea that good will only come once everyone is kind toward one another, whether they are truly friends or not. Kindness paves the way for goodness to move in.

I think Hawthorne would agree with a mixture of both quotes. From reading YGB, I got the impression that Hawthorne would agree more with a quote that combined both ideas, maybe one dealing with people truly become or accomplish evil when they find others that agree with them, and as a result band together.

Maybe Hawthorne would agree with this combination:"We are each of us fallen angels with only one wing, and we can only rise by bonding with one another."

:)

brynnh said...

I agree with the second qoute because of who I am. I think you need help in this world and you can't make it alone.Love is key in being happy in life that is what makes you who you are. I think that is what Lucretius I beleive ther is good inside everyone, you just have to find that good within, that's the hard part. However, I think that Marquez would agreea, but Hawthorne would disagree with this. In his story, going along with the first quote, he argues how evil is already inside of us waiting to be relaesed, and we make this world what it is. I think it just depends on your perception of the world. Are you a half glass full or a half glass empty kind of person? It's easy to find the flaws in people when you are looking for them.

maddyg said...

I agree with the first quote about us being our own devils and making our own hell. To me it meant that yes, there are outside forces acting on us, but ultimately we are in control of whether or not we are happy and wether or not our world is a hell or a heaven. I think Hawthorne would agree with this quote because whether or not Goodman Brown was a dream, he brought the hell that he experienced in the forest on himself through his own actions. I am not sure if Marquez would agree with this quote completely, but in A Very Old Man with Enormous Wings, the wife says at the end how living with this angel was living in hell, and she definitely brought it on herself by keeping him to make money.

Annika_EP said...

I agree with the first quote. I believe that everyone is born good and can only be brought down by the negative forces acting on us. Teamwork and "embracing one another" is such a crucial part of life, because we were never meant to do it all alone. If we were, we really wouldn't be here with everyone else. Embracing one another means loving everyone and living with a truly open heart. It is a hard task, but it can be achieved! We don't live our lives fighting, we live our lives loving.

While Marquez's story was about a man with wings, I think he would accept the first quote to be true. The world, for both the townspeople and for the angel, just really proved to be a hell! Everything was just really dark and unhappy. Hawthorne would also probably accept the second quote, because Goodman Brown was just forced to live the rest of his life in gloom, and he made it that way for himself.

shaunam said...

I agree with both quotes. I do think that people become evil by having negativity crash down around them. Since we as people usually have the ability to control and get what we want, we can always make the world a better place, it's just a matter of getting there. Also, know one really knows you better than yourself, which is why people are also known for being their own worst critic. I think that this could come into play of being our own devil, since only you know your full potential and evil rockbottom that you are capable of.

As for the second quote, I think that it is representing how people need love and support from each other. Not only this, but teamwork, communication and collabortaion is very important to having everything run smoothly from a house to a major company.

I think that Marquez would agree with the first quote because once the angel landed in the town, it proved to be a hell for him. No one accepted him that he was an angel, and they treated him very poorly. Which also leads to the second quote. The angel ended up flying away because he had no one that would help him or care for him with love, so he needed to leave that situation.

Anonymous said...

I think that he second quote relates closely to my own personally philosophy because the only way to escape hell is to make it better and challenge the devil within.

I think that Nathaniel Hawthorne would agree more with the second quote, because Young Goodman Brown accepted his fate of going with the devil to the dark deed, so in a sense he flew just in the wrong direction.

I don't think that these quotations oppose each other but expand on the idea that hell is what you make it and you need help to challenge your own personal devil.

kyle said...

I agree with the first quote in that we are responsible for making this world our own hell, but I also think it works the other way. We are resposible for doing good and making his world more of a heaven than hell.
Hawthorne would obviously agree with the first one, because YGB seemed to be about unleashing the inner devil.
I think these qoutations refer to opposite subject matter, but they don't oppose each other. Everyone has a dark side and a good side, and the first qoute is refering to the dark half and the second is talking about the good half.

Unknown said...

I think that my own personal philosophy would fit more closely with “We are each of us angels with only one wing, and we can only fly by embracing one another” because I believe that humans are flawed and are born with a sinful nature, just like the angels in the quote are flawed because they have only one wing. However, I also agree with Julia and Meghan, who said that humans are not meant to be alone and tend to look to others for support and encouragement. This ties in to the quote because I think that although humans are bent towards sin and are not perfect, they can be righteous with the support of their friends and family or outside spiritual forces (God). I think that Hawthorne would agree with the first quote because “Young Goodman Brown” was a story about how a young man was confronted with the evil within himself as well as the evil within other “righteous” Puritans in his society. The characters in the story seemed to make their own hell on earth when they were having strange ceremonies with the devil. I think that Marquez would also agree with the first quote because the people of the town where the angel landed made it a hell for him and seemed only interested in how the angel’s presence would benefit them. They lost interest when the tarantula girl, who was more entertaining, came along. I think that the quotes do oppose each other because the first quote seems to be saying that humans are basically evil and create their own troubles without offering any hope of a way out. The second quote is more positive, saying that even though humans are flawed, they can make a better life with the support of those around them.

erinl said...

I agree with the first one. I think that there is alot more of bad and hate in this world that kindness and caring. Everyone has a bad side to them wheather they show it or not. No one is perfectin this world. People have a little bit of the devil in themselves and we do make this world our own hell.
I think that Nathaniel Hawthorne would have agreed with this because he seems to think that eveyone has a little bit of the devil in themself, and sometimes the devil disguised is a form that cannot be easily seen.

emilya said...

The second quote fits my personal philosophy... "We are each of us angels with only one wing, and we can only fly by embracing one another." I believe each of us have the power to become close to perfection not only by working on ourselves, but with others. If we work together in a good way we can reach our dreams and we can conquer our weaknesses. I do not believe we are each the devil in which we make this world our hell. I believe we were put on this earth for a trial in which we see if we can resist temptation and do good. We have our free agency. We can choose to be our own devil, or we can choose to be something great.
Nathaniel Hawthorne would most likely agree with the first quotation... "We are each our own devil, and we make this world our hell." I think by the way Goodman Brown and Faith choose to go to the devil's side along with many others shows how we are each our own inside.
I do not think they oppose each other. The first just shows how we are each born as sinners. The second says we need to work together. I can see how one is evil and the other is good, but they do not necesarily oppose each other.

Laine G said...

I agree with the first quote. I don't think that it is saying that life is bad, it is merely saying life is what we make it. To the devil hell is awesome, so it's saying that we make life how we want it. Yeah, probably not how it was intended, but that's how I like to see things. I think that life s exactly what you make of it, it only seems bad if that is how you want to look at things. If I were the devil and this world was hell I would like it as much as I, being me, love the world how it is now.

I think that Gabriel Marquez would agree with the first quote. The quote and story are all about individuality and how everything is based on how you act. The "angel" in the story ignores the people and makes his life how he wants it not letting the townspeople bother him. He then flies away under his own power with no one helping him.

I think that these two quotations oppose each other, just not in the way that most people would think. I think that the first one is about independence, and the second one is about dependency on others to get by.

krump said...

I think I agree more with the second quote, though I don't think they necessarily contradict each other. The first quote is saying that the world is what we make of it, and the second one says that we as human beings need to help each other along. In some ways, I think they are more similar than different.

Julia~ I agree with what you said about how humans hate to feel lonely. This reminds me of how Brady, the creationism lawyer, was feeling in Inherit the Wind.

Brynn~ I like what you said about how the meaning of both quotes depends on the type of person you are. Both quotes could be argued both negitively and positively.

I think that Marquez and Hawthorne would agree with this quote. When Marquez's angel fell, he wasn't able to get up because no one helped him. Similarly, Goodman Brown's decisions were influenced by those he met on the path.

tanal said...

I agree with the first quote in that we are each our own devils, and we make this world our hell because inside everyone there is some evil that is wanting to get out. Although its not how I like to look at life, on the dark side, but everybody isn't perfect. Some people are really hard on themselves and make this life their hell because the evil inside of them is trying to get out but some don't allow that. But we can not go through life alone so I think that the little devil inside each of us only makes us stronger as human beings and helps us learn that only us can control what happens in and out of our body. Also refering back to the blog from last night I think that in Young Goodman Brown, Hawthorne presented evil as being an internal force, and I really think that this leads to us being our own devils.

So on that, I think that Hawthorne would have agreed with this same quote because of the very same reason in that he presented evil as an internal force, but it's not always an obvious thing. I also think that Marquez would have agreed in that we can't go through life alone and that we can help ourselves and the ones around us get stronger together.

Kristen F. said...

I agree with both quotes because I believe that all the obstacles we face in life can be traced back to our own limits and insecurities. The only reason why things don't always go our way is because we allow them to happen that way. The biggest obstacle we face is ourselves. As for the second quote, I completely believe that we need other people in our lives to support us. I am a believer of soulmates and that every person you meet is in your life for a reason so this quote is very close to my philosophy.

I think Marquez would disagree with the first one because in his story, the angel didn't bring his unfortunate position onto himself. Instead, the author made it seem like the townspeople forced him into his metaphoric hell. Hawthorne, however, would probably agree with both quotes. In his story, it was the choices that the individuals made that brought them to the evil ceremony and they weren't forced against their will by any means. Also, the strong connection between Goodman Brown and Faith supports the second quote in that Faith was Goodman Brown's inspiration throughout the story.

These two quotes do not necessarily oppose eachother because they are making two completely different statements about the world. One of them states that life is what you make it while the other one states that we need the support and love of eachother in order to better our lives.

Tina L said...

Wow, lots of people wrote here with so many good thoughts that I don't know where to start.

I think that I personally agree with the second quote, because I am one of those people, like Julia and like Meghan, that believes people are not supposed to be alone. and I HATE being alone, I can't imagine not being able to support people or count on their support in return.

No, the quotes aren't complete opposites, but I think they do represent different ideas. The first quote says that we each are responsible for making our own choices, and for making the world we live in our own hell. The second quote talks more about the fact that we need to depend on each other to "fly." and i don't think that one quote is talking about THE devil, and the other is talking about angels. I think that they could almost be combined, because there is a little good and a little evil in everyone. it is all up to us, i don't think people's actions are caused entirely by outside forces.

I think Hawthorne wouldn't have agreed with either of the quotes. I have decided for now that he believes there is an outside force of evil, and that it was not Goodman Brown's choice to go dreaming about the woods.

Marquez...I still have no idea WHAT that man thinks, but possibly he would agree with the second quote, because in his story he is stressing the idea that we all need to look out for each other by having no one in the story do that. They left the angel in a chicken coop, and only cared about making themselves rich.

jberry said...

I believe that the second quote depicts more of my personal philosophy.
I believe that we are born with the intentions of doing good. It's who we surround ourselves and the actions that we take that allow us to become evil or good. Hawthorne portrays the second quote in the fact that Brother Brown is constantly reminding himself of Faith and his dedication to her; but, he also feels the tension of the devil drawing him closer to bad things.

emmab said...

Although I am a fairly independent person and somewhat agree with the first quote, i would not say that it more closely fits my personal philosphy. Many times, I have to depend on my friends and family to be my "other wing" and I do not believe that humans can survive alone. I believe that humans are born good people, but will eventually discover their numerous flaws and weaknesses, and will be forced to lean on others in their times of need.

Nathanial Hawthorne would most likely agree with the first quote. The quote directly relates to his story because the hell-like situation YGB found himself in, was caused by several of his own actions.

The two quotes do not necessarily oppose one another. However, the second quote is more accepting of mistakes and human flaw. Lucretius seems to understand that although we may bring ourselves to unfortunate places in life, we can get help from other people whom we love to "fly."

Alex_Manning said...

well, I'm not entirely sure I'd ever adopt either of these as my own philosophy, mostly because one is too pessimistic, and one is way too religious. Marquez would most certainly agree with the latter of the two, and Hawthorne with the first. I also don't think that they directly oppose each other, because they don't say so specifically. If they did, a part would state that. The two are simply different viewpoints.

I guess that if the two were combined, in a way that somehow told that we are angels with only one wing, because of our devilish personalities, and together we can fight it.

Anonymous said...

I agree with the second quote. I do believe that there is evil inside us which opposes us from doing the right thing, but as the second quote says, we need help from each other to succeed. That is what lifes all about. If i agreed with the first quote, i would always look for the worst on a person. If every one makes life miserable for themselves, then there wont be any happy optimistic people around anymore.
Both of the authors would agree with others quote to some degree. Gabriel Garcia would agree that there is some evil always inside us, because its the evil that is inside the town people that drove them treat the angel the way they did. Hawthore on the other hand will agree on the second quote as much as he does on the first one. Young goodman brown needed faith to support him and guide him in his journey, but as soon as faith leaves, his minds goes haywire!

Well, thats it! :D

adamb said...

I agree with the first quote, like everybody else. We are our own devils and through our choices we make our personal hell. This however works both ways, good choices lead to heaven, and all of these choices are based on point of view, a good choice will vary from person to person. People making their own hell has been is stories for a while, most notably, Star Wars. In Episode III, Revenge of the Sith, Anakin thinks he is making good choices to help save his wife and his future, but the choices become frequently worse and he evetually kills his comrades, betrays his best friend and hurts his wife which leads to her death and him being half machine relying on artificial organs. He, through his choices, created his own hell. This also relates to the second quote but in a different way. I believe that the second quote relates to the first because it says that other people help you, and help also varies between people, Anakin thinks that he is being helped by the Emperor, but in reality is only plunging deeper into darkness.

endsleye said...

i agree with the second quote. We are usually good but can stray slightly. And other people help us by keeping us in line or helping us make the right choices. The ones that don't help you keep you in line, won't help you fly.


I agree with julia on how Hawthorne would agree with a mixture of the two quotes. He seems to think that everyone is pretty good but then hiding inside of you is the devil. He seems to think that people are both good and bad.


I think that Marquez would agree with the first quote because the towns people made the life a living hell for the angel. so he would probably think that the devil was living in all of us.

saram said...
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saram said...

I agree with what both quotes have to say.
The first one is saying how you are the only one that can truly make your life hell. Being the only one that knows your exact limits, you are the only one that can push yourself to that level.
I believe that the second quote is saying how we weren’t meant to live life and face challenges alone. This quote reminds me of another quote; ‘the reason God put spaces between our fingers is so someone else could fill them.’ It’s saying that the spaces will always be empty unless we can find a person to fill them. So, the second quote is saying that we were put on this earth with some preparation, but there is no way that we could go the whole way by ourselves.
I don't think the quotes oppose each other necessarily. In a way they are saying the same thing. Everyone has a little good and a little evil in them. It just depends on which one you let dominant and show through.

Damian L. said...

I personally prefer the second quote but clearly see where the first comes from. I cannot choose a clear winner of two.

I think that Gabriel Garcia would choose Lucretius' quote and Nathaniel Hawthorne would choose Oscar Wide's quote just based upon what they bring to us through their stories.

The quotes work hand in hand with each other because everyone has both darkness and light sheltered in their hearts.

lauraf said...

I agree with partially both of the quotations because they tie into each other. The second quote is definitely more comforting in the thought of being "angels" but still in need of support. Which I believe is true. Not that people are angels, but they have potential for good which is brought about by "embracing one another." I also believe we can make our world hell by only relying on our individual selves and not trusting others or receiving their support.
In the short story Young Goodman Brown, Hawthorne ties both quotes into Brown's life. When he grasps the "wrong" people, like the influence from the Devil in the forest, that is how the world becomes hell. By choosing positive influences, one can metaphorically fly, but can also be pulled down by "our own devil."

[Collin L] said...

I think that the two quotations go hand in hand. Even though we make our world a "hell", if we help one another we can "fly". I think that Hawethorn would agree with the quote that says that we are each our own devil... because in his short story, Young Goodman Browne is compelled time and time again by the "devil" inside of him. I think that the author of "an old man with very large wings" would agree with my veiw point, because in the story both have relivance. When the old man is lying in the mud, and in the chicken coupe, that is a "hell" that he has made for himself, and the town in which the angel fell is considered "hell" by those who occupy it. However is someone had taken time to comfort the old man, to help his tired body and give him an adaquet living quarters, i believe that he would have taken off from the town alot earlier than he did. Both quotes are true, in order to escape the "hell" that we humans have made for ourselves, we must help each other overcome both physical and mental boundaries. There is no future, but what we make for ourselves.

jessie w said...

I agree with the second quote. We are not perfect, and each and every one of us needs help to "fly." Personally, I think that help we need is from Jesus. We can't make it through life alone, and we need others to help us with our journey.

I think Hawthorne would have agreed with both. The first one describes more of an internal conflict which Goodman Brown struggled with. The second one describes how Goodman Brown began his journey off without evil, and as the story went on, without the help of other "angels," he couldn't "fly." Satan pulled him down from the sky.